Barbara Stokol
Barbara Stokol's family came from Lithuania, and both of her parents were born in South Africa, making her a second-generation South African. She grew up in Klerksdorp, a town about a hundred miles from Johannesburg in the gold fields, where the Jewish community was vibrant and active with youth groups and a congregation that outgrew its old synagogue and built a large new one, the very place where she and Arnie later married. She was raised by a visionary father who had four daughters, and later a son, and who encouraged all his children to become educated and prepared to build lives elsewhere.
Barbara met Arnie in pharmacy school in 1971. She graduated as a pharmacist while he changed professions to become an optometrist. Troubled by the political situation in South Africa and seeking a stable future for their future children, the couple left the country in 1978, part of the first small wave of South African emigration. After a period in England and time in Houston, where Arnie earned his doctorate, they chose Dallas for its Jewish community and a job offer that helped secure his green card. They arrived with a six-week-old baby, and Barbara, a trained pharmacist unable to practice in the United States, worked as a secretary for an insurance agent to help make ends meet.
In Dallas the family found the Jewish community, and particularly its South Africans, warm and welcoming. Their son attended a preschool, they joined the JCC, and later joined Shearith Israel for Hebrew school and their children's b'nai mitzvah. Barbara and Arnie became United States citizens and consider themselves proudly American, while continuing to celebrate Jewish holidays with beloved South African traditions and foods. The family has grown in Dallas, with Arnie's brother joining them, their daughter married to a Dallas man, and a grandchild. Reflecting on her journey, Barbara believes the first wave of South African immigrants was uniquely motivated and has contributed a great deal to the community.
Full Transcript
good afternoon hi I'm Barbara stoeckel and today is May the 13th of 2015 very good tell me Barbara a little bit about where your family came from if you can't even prior to being in South Africa and what can you share about your early lives when you got there my family's came from Lithuania and both my parents were born in South Africa so I was a second-generation South African and what did you want to know about my early life in southern if anything you'd like to share anything that was memorable when you were young they're growing up there I think that the Jewish community you
know the small towns had large Jewish communities because the Jews would become SMO sirs and they would go out into the country and then they would set up shop eventually and that's how those small towns were settled month Judaism so growing up we had a large Jewish community we had her boredom groups we had youth groups we very active went from a very small shop I'm from clarks talk where is that exactly as hundred miles from johannesburg in the gold fields and I remember growing up with a very old shell and we burst at the seams so they built a beautiful new big shop where
we got married and now there is no sure it's gone back to but I think they're 25 people left in cox's door in a little house that they important you know the whole surface is there but it's it's getting harder and harder to get a minute how and why did you make the decision to leave South Africa and by the way when did you meet your husband and on and i met in pharmacy school in 1971 i continued and graduated he decided to change professions and became an optometrist so I was raised with a very forward-thinking father great visionary and he had at that point
four daughters subsequently we had a younger brother board but he was way later and raised all it us girls to get educated with something we could move with and get out because he goes south africa 20 years 60 years ago and so I was it was not a question that I was leaving the country I'm met on e who didn't like the political situation the way the blacks were treated and he was leaving the country so it was a match we will leave it and we didn't want to start a family and him started practice in a country that had no future for our children
once you had made the decision to leave and obviously was mutual what were you then thinking and feeling and what steps did you take to me it was a great exciting adventure we didn't give two minutes of thoughts about our family at all we a honeymoon we went to England we thought we were going to actually several there stay there they didn't want us we didn't want them eventually and we left England and that's when he decided to apply to America to come into the doctorate here so it was Israel could have been an option but we couldn't make it and couldn't make ends meet
as an optometrist and if in his room what was your family's reaction to your decision to leave my family's reaction was great tonight because of how I was raised on his father thought he was crazy and that he would grow up one day and we'd be back did anybody near you close to also have the same things going on where they were decided to leave around the same time you were any family members or friends nobody nobody else this was in 1978 it's been me wrapped in this country very few people were leaving South Africa at that time we got to dallas and they were
you know a handful I mean but nothing not even that in the droves and the numbers that left in the 80s and later on so you're in the first wave of emigration it was your age together yeah okay you said you spent some time in England how did you settle on Dallas Texas as opposed to any other cities here in the US are needed his doctorate in at the University of Houston he was accepted at the school day the boards will he finish in the December the boards were written in the January and he got a job offer from a wonderful man called mourir a
who owns optical clinic here in dentist who offered him immigration and work we do his green card and a job and we like Texas we just didn't like Houston and so we were looking for somewhere to go with a Jewish community because that was important to us and this offer came out of you know just connections and each of it and what were you doing at the time did you find a job here as well um I oh and by the way we had a six week old baby so he had to work and I didn't know this but I came to this country pregnant
in 78 and in those days South Africa was not allowing more than a certain dollar amount out of the country and so as the student and the spouse of a student we could get 800 800 grand a month which translated into twelve hundred dollars which we were living off at that point and are you having a baby was going to complicate matters wouldn't have insurance it was going to cost money for the OD Jen it was going to well it was going to definitely be a cost and so the only way that we could sorry okay yes go ahead and sorry we were back with
your baby having a baby and the insurance and everything right okay so and so I so I decided I had to work and you all know this because you're not an immigrant but when you're on a visa as a spouse of a student you do not get a work visa I mean it's just not even doesn't happen and so I said you know when I got to give it a shot we went down to immigration and had to pull a number and my number was 13 and it's my lucky number and I said Johnny I'm getting a work permit and he's told the gentleman who
interviewed us what was going on and he gave me a part-time work permit so I then said well what am I going to do because I'm a pharmacist but I called branches as a pharmacist because I'm not qualified here in this country and going for it there was clerking position as it out until I can file I can tell me I can do that so I go for the interview and they give me an IQ test and she says to me Oh Barbara you can't do this she said you're going to be bored out of your mind within the next first and week but we
have this insurance agent she's looking for a secretary and you'd be perfect I sit at an and when I did my typing test I was so ignorant I went back to correct my typing which apparently you're not supposed to do and i said to you do understand that I'm a pharmacist and you do understand that I've never being a secretary and she said he said that's fine and he took me on and I work for him full time at chili for until until trevor was born and in fact when I left you asked me if I knew any other South African pharmacists they were looking
for jobs she was so good at tell me what were your first impressions of Dallas if you can remember memorable or otherwise and also what type of adjust issues did you have being in Dallas which is a particular place here in the US my first memories that were how warm and welcoming the Jewish community was particularly the South Africans the israel since the beverly lewin you know I mean at what that's all you have to say and then there was there was it before I knew trevor was in a preschool that sort of ejecta I mean that's just the way it was and so it
was only only good stuff what about Dallas the city at large besides the Jewish community how did you feel about the city it looks a bit the way it was so different i'm sure from where you used to back home well you know heading on to houston in the interim gave us some idea we didn't come straight from south africa to dallas so it was another big city and as we all know we live our lives in our little areas you know you have your bank and you're dry clean or whatever so and when you have a young baby you're so involved with just trying
to raise this child that you're not very aware or take part much in what's going on in the city so did you join anything or were you particularly active anything in your early days here you and your husband I'm on II was working and then was just going to start a practice so because there was a lot of involvement with starting the practice getting alone finding whatever and we joined the JCC when we got you in our the early times i was playing racquetball here and doing exercise classes and taking advantage of their daycare facilities we trevor was going to Solomon chapter we did not
join a show until much later what did you join when you decided to UM Sharath Israel it's really we landed up and that was for starting Hebrew school and borough bat mitzvahs when the kids the kids really didn't need Hebrew school school together with Solomon chapter but we needed a place to have a more abutments first so that's what motivated us so you said you found the Jewish community very welcoming what about do you remember any impressions at all about the city the community at large how they welcomed you as far as being an immigrant from another country you have any impressions of that well
I think they're always intrigued with the South Africans especially in those early days you know the accent and everything that goes with that and um we are very accepting always interested you know what made you come here that kind of stuff so that always is a like a segue to to a discussion a relationship yeah through the years have you joined anything civic-minded our community minded besides the Jewish community have you gotten involved in anything and our knees involved in rotary civic-minded not great I haven't done anything with you stuffing mines okay what do you feel or can you remember any of your South African
Jewish cultural things that you carried over and brought here things that you still retain and still did with your family living here particularly South African well first of all you know I'm a yawn turf wars yontiff and because we celebrate all our Jewish holidays with South Africa news you want to us continue to be your turf we make excellent hearing and we make I don't know what else with you typical South African yontiff meals celebrations whatever it is basic recipes that kind of stuff along that line is there anything you can think of that you no longer follow and did so you know with that
clear thought in mind bringing over here that you did not want wish to continue Jewish or otherwise that you can think of no not really okay do you think your children well you're both your will your family at large do they think they will continue some of the customs that you consider South African Customs or has that kind of gone by the wayside what I hope stopped because we do continue that and we only have one son in law and we are definitely converging him to to how we do it and the way we do it in the foods we do and but I don't
know you know at this point Jody doesn't do much cooking since she's still at school and has shows not much interested in continuing those things and a lot of a lot of a lot of what we do not be bringing tradition wise it's got to do with food you know what else is that if you think about it but but josh is always willing to to try new things and experiment and be a part of it so I don't know I know Zionism was very much a part of you growing up how have you carried that over here what are your fears on rhythm is
was really even though we belong to Jewish youth groups they intention might of being alia Bhatt when you 10 and 11 and 12 all you're interested in is being with your friends on a Sunday morning and participate in you right so I'm not sure buddy I was ever on on our minds necessarily and as I told you earlier we tried to we had an opportunity at least for six months even to go and work in Israel while we were waiting to come to the United States and it just wasn't economically feasible we put a different way then for set aside earlier how do you feel
today living in the States about Israel or any connections with it very supportive we know a lot of people that live in Israel sukuk South Africans you know barb bonds we whatever anyway we can to support it him have you had a chance to go back home to South Africa since you've been here and if so how often or one of you gone I went home back to South Africa often when the kids were younger my dad would will travel so the only way that he would get to see them was by me taking them and as the years went on in my dad passed
away it wasn't as frequent my mom would usually come bring her to visit us here but we go back all the time for burn but let's furs for weddings now and constant back and forth so I had asked you earlier when you were younger if anybody came over around the same time you were coming has that changed people that you knew directly that you were close with either relatives or friends and they come here since you've been here so longer no they still retain remain there and now a number of our friends have come up not my family I have two siblings have moved to
Australia a bet did not come to the United States it seems to be the other choice a good choice yeah yeah um what if anything do you miss about your life in South Africa not a thing really not a thing beautiful country we go back wonderful to visit one farms Cape Town I mean safaris fabulous opposed to visit not a thing okay talk about your citizenship a little bit do you consider yourself an American and if so how did you become a u.s. citizen absolutely consider ourselves omnia American voted the first time Reagan went into office what year was that don't remember in the aid link it 82 yeah to come back it up and once however said all he got at the screen card Mario would do the green card for him he he did he got his green card got up green cards waited for five years which have to wait got our citizenship and voted good and the kids were both born here so they were automatically US citizens described to us how has your family grown since you've been here grow hi Arnie's brother came over with his
family to this area because we were here Jody's married a Dallas boy and at this point is in Dennis so we've got a whole new family on the other side very good any grandkids yet yes yes Maya she's eight months at all sweet wonderful and what does jodi do in her husband journey has just graduated as a doctor this week Mazel Tov in fact graduation is next week and well and it has matched here in Dallas Texas for her pathology residency so they're going to be here for the next four years we just wonderful apparel josh is bad profession a lawyer and working in his
family's business so Levine started a schmatta business and the family has continued at four hundred years and is working they right now fabulous okay so in general I think I already know the answer to this but just in your own words why you're glad that you came here that you ended up here well we've achieved what we wanted to and that was to give our kids a future in a country that was politically stable and in fact Joe Deiters turn around and toss for it because her cousins who stood in South Africa who the same page group are grappling with the same issues do we
stay do we go do we leave this do we go on an adventure and she said that was taken that decision was made for us for her in our moving has she been in touch with her cousins and trying to convince them and with which way you know you know they were adults duty they're not going to convince anybody of anything but are they've been here to visit oh yeah oh yeah you take the head Barney sister won the green card lottery do you know what a green card lottery is I can guess the child tell me what is it well you won't know this
but your immigration department I don't actually does it but puts out lower it luxuries around the world and what's interesting is that if you haven't if you don't have a high school degree have a high school graduation diploma or whatever they call it they tell you do not even bother to continue this process so what they trying to do is encourage educated people and I'm re sister brother-in-law all three kids got this fifteen years ago and still too just recently turn it in yeah they gave it up so you're kind of anything more the Med land in your lap if you don't want it you
know they did it for their kids same as what we did one of the children is landed up in England and the other two don't want to leave but the interesting thing there is is that they have a plan for this Iranian passports and which gives them EU ability to be anywhere in Europe so they that's their way of ensuring for their kids that if they want you they can leave the country later on it's a good way to do it yeah so in conclusion tell us Barbara in your own words whatever you like anything else that you would like to add at all anything
at all to this interview out there you know I think that the first wave of South African immigrants was not a true sampling of immigrants in general you know all the South Africans but it was a group that was clearly motivated not most immigrants or they come to this country the room to get away from other political unrest and certain and futures uncertain futures and I think they've done an amazing amazing job but I think the South Africans are well thought of and and successful in the other way and have added a lot to the community I agree with that and I thank you so
much for your time thanks for doing this map Asia