Carmen Miller
Carmen Jablow Miller was born on June 11, 1892, in a small country town in Kentucky, one of three children. Her father had left Russia as a young man, arriving in New York with a dollar and no English, and made his living peddling before establishing a dry goods business in Kentucky. He eventually brought over his five brothers and his mother, who lived with the family for some fifteen or sixteen years and kept her own kosher dishes. Carmen's mother had come to America as a young woman and lived with the Marcus family in Louisville, as her sister was Mrs. Marcus, mother of Herbert Marcus of Neiman Marcus. Carmen grew up very close to her sister Ray, who was nineteen months older.
After graduating high school with her sister, Carmen was invited to Texas by her relatives. She and Ray came to Dallas at the urging of the Neiman and Marcus families and stayed for months at a time, enjoying the lively social season centered on the Columbian Club, where Jewish girls made their debuts. In 1913 she married Henry S. Miller Sr. at the Columbian Club, in a ceremony performed by Dr. Greenberg. The couple lived first on Wendelkin Street, then built a home on South Boulevard where they lived for twenty-seven years, in a neighborhood that was almost entirely Jewish. Around 1948 or 1949 they left South Dallas and later settled in the University Park area. They had three children.
Carmen's husband began his career in the wholesale department at Sanger Brothers, then entered the real estate business, opening his own firm in 1919 and becoming known as Mr. Realtor. He was president of Temple Emanu-El and its Brotherhood, a leader in the Masonic lodge and Shrine, and active in opposing the Ku Klux Klan. Carmen belonged to the Council of Jewish Women, the Sisterhood, and Hadassah, and attended Federation fundraising meetings. Her brother, Dr. Jablow, was a physician who trained in Louisville and Chicago, served on a transport ship in World War I, moved to Dallas, and was remembered as one of the most willing doctors to answer charity calls. Carmen also recalled her charitable mother-in-law, Sophie Miller, who visited the poor and sick with Mrs. Cann before the Federation existed. Her younger son was killed in World War II.
Full Transcript
This is Rose Biederman. I'm with the Dallas Jewish Historical Society. The date is Tuesday, June the 26th, 1990. This is Rose Biederman. I am going to interview Mrs. Henry S. Miller Sr. in her home at 6335 Northwest Highway in the Athena Apartments. Mrs. Miller, would you please tell me your full name? My full name is Carmen Jablow Miller. And where were you born? I was born in Camelsfield, Kentucky. How long did you live in Kentucky? I lived there until I was 19 years old. Would you mind telling me when you were born? What? Would you mind telling me when you were born, your birth date?
I was born on June 11, 1892. 1892? When did your parents come to Kentucky? You remember? No, I don't really know which question that I've asked myself and wondered why I didn't ask myself. I was able to, yeah. Were you so many things I would like to have asked them? You know, when your mother came to Kentucky, you know when she came, more or less. Well, I think she might have, I really don't know. She was a young woman. She was a young woman. I imagine she was about 19 or 20 years old. Was she married in this country? She was married. Here in the Louisville, Kentucky.
Oh, uh-huh. You have the... The date? The date on the certificate. Yeah, I have it at home. But you know that your father was already in Kentucky My father was already there So he was just a young man in his place My father arrived in New York What it must have been in... 18... Well, I really don't know. It was not awful, not to a different age. There's so many things I wish I knew. Yeah. Do you know why he came? No, I don't know. Okay, okay. But he left Russia because he wanted to get away. Uh-huh, yeah. He was the first member of his family to arrive in this country.
Uh-huh, uh-huh. Without a word of English, knowing a word of English and a dollar in his pocket. what kind of business did he have in kentucky he had a drag race business but he first pedaled like so many of them did right right that's how they learned the language um somebody told you or he told you how he got started pedaling didn't they tell you that Oh, yes. He said that when he arrived in New York, he had a dollar in American money, and he didn't know a word of English. Right. And he left Ellis Island, and he was walking down the street, and he met another Russian, and the Russian had some seats for cash.
Cane? Cane? Didn't you tell me cane? Seats? Seats. Uh-huh. And he said they stopped and spoke to each other. And this man said that he was peddling these seats and he made enough money to pay for his upkeep, his room and board. And he asked my father if he would like for him to show him where he bought them. Oh. Oh, so he did show him where. And then from there on I don know just why my father went to Kentucky but he did and he peddled and he made enough money to send for his brothers He had five brothers and he would send for them to come over here and finally to his mother.
And they all settled in Kentucky? No. Oh, but they all came... I'm a mother settled in New York City. Oh, I see. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. But my grandmother came to live with us, and she lived with us for about, oh, I guess 15, 16 years. Uh-huh. How many were in your family? Did you have any brothers or sisters? I had one brother and one sister. Okay. They were both older than I am. Uh-huh. My brother was, I guess, about three or four years old, and my sister was 19 months older than I. We were like twins. We grew up like twins. We were very, very close.
Sure. Well, that was nice. My whole family was very close. That's nice. And my mother came to this country when she was a young woman, and the Marcus family was living in Louisville at that time. And Mrs. Marcus and my mother were sisters. Oh. That was the... You mean the mother of Herbert Marcus? Of Herbert Marcus. I see. That was Neiman. Uh-huh. Their mother? Yes. And so my mother went to live with them. You know, in those days families took care of them. Right, that's right, yes. And she lived with them for several years until she married. Uh-huh, uh-huh. She married in their home. And that was in Kentucky?
That was in Louisville. In Louisville, Kentucky. That's interesting. You have to say Louisville like they say it. Well, Louisville. I'm not used to that. Some people called it Louisville. I know. But people who are Louisville, Louisville is what they say. I've always said Louisville. That an interesting pronunciation a different pronunciation The Marcus family with the exception of one daughter moved to Texas for some reason And when I was... After I graduated from high school, my sister and I, we graduated together. we started to school. Is that right? And finished together. Mrs. Neiman and Mr. Neiman came to Louisville with them up with Carrie, Neiman's mother and father, to visit us.
Uh-huh. And they said he would like to take my sister and me back to Texas with them. Well, my parents said my sister could come to Texas. She was the older one, that I might come at a later time. So my sister came down to visit them for a short time, and she stayed for seven months. And so the next year, Mr. and Mrs. Herbert Marcus and their two children, Stanley and Edward, who's the older children, came to visit us. And Mr. Marcus went to New York to buy for the store. And Mrs. Marcus stayed to visit us. Uh-huh. And when they left, they took, brought me.
Oh. And brought you to Dallas? To Dallas. And Mrs. Neiman wanted my sister, too, so she sent her a ticket to come to Dallas. What was your sister's name? My sister was Mrs. Lea Mishindy. And her first name? Her name was Ray. Ray. R-A-C-A race, that kind of a race. Oh, okay, okay. Leon Lichtenstein was the brother of Mrs. Herbert Marcus. Oh. So it was quite a mixed up. Mr. Marcus was her first cousin, and Mrs. Marcus... This was his sister now. Oh my. So we stayed down for eight months, the both of us. Uh-huh. They never wanted us to go home. And I became engaged to my husband.
And the next... We had quite a long engagement. and I intended to stay home with my family because I was going to move away from them but Mrs. Neiman kept writing for me to come back to Dallas so I came back to Dallas and stayed with them until I married What year did you marry? In 1913. In 1913. That was 75 years ago. Oh my goodness. Who married you? Dr. Greenberg. Dr. Greenberg. Were you married at Temple? No, I was married at the Columbia Club. Oh. When it was on Irby Street? Yes. Was that common practice to have weddings there? I think it was. Uh huh.
Uh huh. What was the social life in Dallas when you came? You came as a young girl? Very gay. Very gay. Very gay. The girls made the debuts in those days, the Jewish girls. Uh huh. At the Columbian Club? At the Columbian Club. They gave very elaborate parties. And there were many visitors. Young girls came to visit friends and family. And there were parties given to everybody. It was a very gay season. Was it, did you feel that it was a close Jewish community, that they were close? Yes, it was a very close community. And there was something I found in Dallas that I didn find in Louisville In Louisville there was a feeling between the Russian Jew and the German Jew You mean a bad feeling.
You mean a bad feeling. A bad feeling. The German Jews considered them better than the Russian Jews. I never had that feeling. I mean, it never interfered with my life because I guess most people considered me German. But I resented that feeling because my father was Russian. And I resented. I knew the feeling existed. But I didn't find that true when I came to Dallas. It's just a big community. Did most of the people live in the area of the Columbian Club? In the area? In that neighborhood, in South, that was. In that neighborhood, around where the Columbian Club was located? Well, no, because that was not of a residence.
Well, but in that area. The temple was in that neighborhood, the city park was there, and the Columbian Club. I know when we first married, we lived on Wendelkin Street. When you first got married? When I first married. That's your first? Right. That was your first home? My first home. Oh. And then we built a home on South Boulevard. Okay. I knew you lived there in 1914. I didn't realize that was your first home. Yes. Okay. I know where that is very well. When she asked you about living in the neighborhood of the Columbian Club, that's far, it's quite a distance. But the Columbian Club was on Irving Street in those.
That was not your neighborhood. Okay. Where did, when you stayed with the Marcuses, where did they live when you visited, when you first came? They lived on Colonial Avenue Mrs Rosenbaum I don know whether you knew her was a sister of Mrs Neiman and Herbert Marcus She lived on Colonial, and Mrs. Neiman lived with me, and Mr. Neiman lived with Rosenbaum. I see. What was her first name? Minnie. Minnie. Minnie Rosenbaum? That's a new name. No, I'd never heard that name. There was one other brother and that was Theo Marcus. Right, but he didn't live in Dallas. Yes, he lived in Dallas. Oh, it was my understanding he lived in, was Marshall or?
Now he lived down on Irving Street when I first came here. Oh really? Didn't they live in Marshall at one time? Yes. But they also lived in Dallas. I don't know about Marshall, but I think so, but I'm trying to think they lived. Well, I know that his wife, Ophelia, used to talk about Marshall. Yes, I think the Rosenbaum family did live in Marshall. But it was because of the Rosenbaum's, not because of the Marcus's. Okay. See, many Rosenbaum's married to Rosenbaum. Oh, my. Many, not many Marcus married. There were too many Marcus. Yes. Oh, goodness. Herbert Marcus's wife was Minnie. Right. And then Carrie Neiman's sister was Minnie.
Okay. And Minnie Marcus married Abe Rosenbaum, and Ophelia Rosenbaum married Keo Marcus, sister and brother, Mary's sister. Oh, my. That gets complicated. You have a wonderful memory. Herbert's wife and his sister were both named Minnie. Herbert Marcus wife was Minnie and he had a sister named Minnie Yeah Yeah Um I have a few notes and I discovered that your husband had worked for Sanger Brothers When I married him he was working in the wholesale department office. And then the next year he went into business? Into Disney. Into real estate. Well that might be recorded. Was that a big step to take, a newly married family?
Well I guess it was. He went into business with a man by the name of Davis and one by the name of... Was it Davis or David? Davidson and Davis. Oh, Davidson and Davis. You got it. The war broke out shortly after, and one of the men decided he wanted to join the war, so he broke up the firm. The firm, and my husband went to work for a real estate firm in Highland Park. Prypon and Prather. Prypon and Prather. Uh-huh. And he told Mr. Prather when he went into business that he was only doing this because of the war, that as soon as the war was over, he expected to go into his own business again.
Oh. So he worked for Mr. Flippin for several years during the war. Uh-huh. And then after the war, he decided to go into business for himself, and this time without any partner. I see. I have 1919, he opened his own real estate office. How long did you live on Wendelkin? We lived on Wendelkin until the end of June. Well, look, Kildare, we must have lived for at least five years. The ears because we sold our home and went to live with my mother. My brother went to war. My brother was a doctor and he went to war. And his room was vacant and my sister was and her husband and little daughter was living with them.
So week three, Henry Junior and my husband and I went over to live with them until another house on Wendell Street was ready for us. So we moved across the street from where we had lived before. Where was your mother living? My mother was living on Colonial. On Colonial. Uh-huh. And then we built a house on South Boulevard. Was Colonial and Wendelkin, were those streets sort of a Jewish neighborhood? Yes. Very much so? Yes. And you then built a home on South Boulevard? South Boulevard, and we lived there for 27 years. My goodness. Then we built a house. We wanted to build another house, but we rented for several years in Highland and University Park.
When did you leave South Dallas? Do you remember what year you actually left South Dallas? 1950, I think. Was it? About 1950. That's a big transition occurred around that time. Well, it might have been 1948. I think it might have been. 15 years. On Coelhurst. On Coelhurst. Yeah. Uh... Well, that's... I think it was about 48 or 49 when they left South Boulevard. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Because you went... I was away at school. You was away. Right. I interested in what life was like when you were living on Wendelkin and then when you moved to South Boulevard Did the neighbors get together? Did you go to social clubs?
Well, my life was very quiet because I had a baby, Henry Jr. And I was rather particular. I wouldn't leave him with anybody but my mother or my sister. So I really, I had a neighbor who used to, a lovely neighbor, a gentile neighbor, and she used to beg me, she'd read in the paper that there was going to be a dance at the Clemming Club. and she'd say, Miss Miller, why don't you and Mr. Miller go and leave the baby with me? And I said, well, someday I'm going to need somebody and then I'll call on you. And when my sister was in labor, I called her and I said, now's the time.
I know that you had a lot of Jewish neighbors on South Boulevard. In fact, I think the whole block was Jewish. The whole block across the street and on our side was entirely Jewish. And not just one block. No, not just 12. Most of the blocks. But for about three blocks, it was just entirely Jewish. What was that like? It was very nice. I never had any prejudice. That's right. I'm sure it must have been very nice. And your children grew up with friends that they went to school with them to probably the Sunday School and so forth. Yeah. They went to the Brown School over there at Forrest High, except for Carmen, she went to Arthur Day.
In fact the what I guess you would call them the clientele at Forest Avenue had changed quite a bit There was a different Children, there were, in fact one of the teachers out there who'd been out there a long time told Delano Levi that the only nice children out there were Jewish children. You mean by the time I grew up, by the time I was growing up? Yes, by the time. We went, Carmen quit school in midterm and half a day doesn't have any midterm crisis. So she went to Forest High for six months, but the children were not the kind of children who'd always gone there when my boys went there.
I see. I wanted to ask, if you don't mind, I know that your husband's family, especially his grandfather, had been orthodox. Yes. And his father, Sam, had also been orthodox and had been president of Shareth Israel. Did your husband start out Orthodox? Because I know he joined the temple, and I was wondering how much? I don't know. I really don't know. And his father afterwards joined our temple. I don't know whether you remember, there was a Dr. Gold here. He was sort of a man who thought he was superior. Uh-huh. He really was. In fact, we had an ice man. You know, in those days, they delivered ice to you every day.
And he said, I see Dr. Gold every day, and he's never bid me good morning. but anyway my husband brother died and Dr Gold father ignored the millers and dad father resented that very much She joined our temple and she was one of the members who really made use of the temple. But they used to go to the temple every Saturday. Well, Dad must have been brought up in a more traditional way, but he never really talked about it. And I didn't know enough to ask him about it. Did you ever keep kosher in your home? No. Okay. And I don't think that his mother kept pushing, did she?
I don't think so. I don't think so. They probably didn't eat any pork. Well, in my home there was never any pork or anything like that. We lived in a country town until I was about seven, eight years old. But we never had any pork in our home or anything like that, but we never kept kosher. And my grandmother came to live with us. When she came to this country, she thought she would live in New York City where there was a shoe, along the Dove Temple, and of course she would keep kosher, but she didn't get along with her in those. And she came to live with us.
We didn't keep kosher. We had a cow, and there was plenty of milk and cream. She made cottage cheese. Uh-huh. And we had all kinds of fruit trees. Oh. Plum and peaches, pears, cherry, apple, everything, and a great big garden with every kind of vegetable that you can think of. We had chickens that laid lots of eggs. So she found plenty. Sure. It sounds like really. But she kept her own. This is because, you know, my mother, she wouldn't have trusted my mother. If anything, she kept the culture for herself. That's interesting that she kept her own dishes, but I think that was sort of common also that many, my mother used to make butter, you know, she made it a churn.
I think she used the butter that my mother made because it wasn't used to anything. Right. Anything else but butter. I know that your husband was very active at Temple. He was president of Temple Emanuel and president of the Brotherhood. He was called Mr. Realtor, very active in real estate affairs, active as a civic leader and cultural leader. Were you active in Temple? No. Okay. I think you mentioned earlier you paid your dues to many organizations. I was a member of the council and the sisterhood. I was a member of the, oh, what's it, that I belong to. Oh, you belong to Hadassah now, but you didn't used to.
No, but I... You do belong to Hadassah for many years. And I've never attended a meeting. Isn't that awful? No, it's not awful. I'm a member of a lot of Jewish organizations, but I never had. The only meetings that I ever attended were the Federation meetings, where we got money for the Federation. I used to attend those. Did you celebrate Jewish holidays in your home after you were married Well we did I think to a certain extent but not properly If I had to do it over again I would do it a little differently You talked a little bit about the Jablow family and about your grandmother.
Would you tell me about your brother because I recently, well Carmen your daughter mentioned that he was a doctor here. Yes. Would you tell me where he went to school? He went to school at the University of Louisville. Okay. And he graduated from there and then he interned at the Marine Hospital in Chicago. Naval. Naval Hospital. Naval Hospital. Was Marine. Was Marine? Okay. Excuse me. They called it Marine, but... He was in the Navy, though. It was... Okay. They were together. Yes. Okay, excuse me. You're right. Then when the war broke out, Now which war? First World War? First World War. He enlisted and he served as an officer on the, on a transport ship.
Oh, uh-huh. Ship would go to France and come back to France. Get another load of soldiers. Yeah. When did he move to Dallas? When we did, see he was just ready to start his practice. Uh huh. And he came to, told him I was practicing in Dallas. Uh huh. Uh huh. Did he ever marry? He married very late in life. He married a nurse. Her name was Mildred Bass. She was not Jewish. Although my brother always was Jewish we were always family I knew there was a Dr Japlow and I had seen in old Federation records that he was one of the doctors who would tend to charity cases or investigate and so I knew there was a Dr Jablow, but I had no information on him.
Well, you know, Mom, he lived here, he lived with my mother. How long did he practice here? Well, he practiced all of his life. My mother-in-law was a very charitable woman. She and Mrs. E.M. Cann used to come with her carriage once a week, and they'd go out and visit the poor and the sick. Is that right? that was before the Federation. Right. See, we didn't have any ordinary. Right. And they would see what was needed in the way of clothes and medicines and so forth. And they would go every week. That's interesting. He always said that my brother was one of the most willing of the doctors to take a call.
And there were some of them who weren't there, really. I know there were two doctors mentioned. I'm sorry I don't remember the other one, but I remember that name. He was one of them that seemed to be mentioned very often. That's very interesting. Well, when he graduated from medical school, my mother said something that she hoped he would always take care of the poor. Uh-huh. Well, he minded his mother. And he did. Uh-huh. Very commendable. That's very interesting. Well, we saw that example before us. My father was never a wealthy man, but he was a very charitable man. Uh-huh. All my life I can remember the things he would give to you know.
And I remember when he moved to Dallas and he was the first person that I ever saw that did that Whenever any of the children the grandchildren were sick or something he'd come to my husband with a check, and he'd say, Henry, you know better words than this than I do. He would send a check if it's all of a Thanksgiving. Right, uh-huh. And I had never seen that before. Well, that's a religious practice. Yes. You're supposed to do that, or it's something that you can do. That's very interesting. Your comments are wonderful. Do you remember Dr. Greenberg, you said, married you? Do you have any recollections about Dr.
Greenberg? Well, I was very fond of him. The rabbi of our temple in Louisville was rather cold fish. Shake hands with him and just, you know, you had to ever shake hands with somebody, it would just hold out his hand and now squeeze your hand or something. And when I came to Dallas, Dr. Greenberg was such a warm, sweet, nice person that I liked him very, very much. I know he was active in cultural affairs as well as being the rabbi. You have any recollection of his activities? activities. He was not a good speaker. Not a good speaker? No. So when Dr. Lefkowitz came, he was a very fine speaker.
People thought he was wonderful. Is that why he was hired? Do you know why Dr. Lefkowitz was hired? No, I don't know why. I think he satisfies most people. Yeah. And Dr. Ruff, the one that followed him, Levi Olin, I thought he was a wonderful man. I understand Dr. Greenberg left about 1980. And Dr. Lefkowitz came in 1920, so there was a couple of years or so when there was not a rabbi. Do you remember anything about that, that period? No, I don't remember that. Okay. I was just wondering how Dr. Lefkowitz was, whether he was interviewed, whether he came here to speak, or you don't know why he was hired?
Well, I think my husband was on that committee, wasn't he? He may have been on the committee, but there was a group that went up to Dayton or wherever he was to interview him. To Cincinnati. Cincinnati. Dad was not in that group. Dad went to Cincinnati. He did? because I remember distinctly he met a cousin of mine from Lexington, Kentucky. Because Rabbi Klein recently gave a lecture on the Lefkowitz years and it was mentioned about people going up to Cincinnati or wherever. Well, Dad went to Cincinnati. He didn't mention Dad's name, but he did mention some other people, I think. I think Stanley Marcus said that his father went.
Could Herbert Marcus have gone? Herbert could have gone because he was president of the temple. Well, anyway, a group did go up. I have the feeling he didn't come down and give a sermon, though. before he was hired. Well, Dad went up for one of... Maybe it was for Levi Olin. I think it was. I think it was. I don't think Dad was involved... I think he went up when Levi Olin... In going to get Lefkowitz. I think he went up when Olin was hired. Okay, okay. Any remembrances special remembrances you might have of the temple on South Boulevard Or the activities there Well, I know we used to go every Friday night, because at that time my husband had to sit on the roster.
and he would take a nap every Friday so that he wouldn't go to sleep on the rush. Did all the children go? Did the whole family go? No. I remember Dr. Lefkowitz. Must be some child misbehaved. He'd glare at them, except David Jr. And David Jr. was a naughty boy. But his father never saw him misbehaving. But if another child misbehaved, he'd just sit and glare at them. Could you tell us something about Rabbi Lefkowitz? Was he well liked at Temple? What's that? Rabbi Lefkowitz, was he a well liked Rabbi at Temple? I think he was very well liked. And all your children went to Sunday school there?
I didn't ask you how many children you had. I had three children. My younger boy was killed in the Second World War. And Carmen is the youngest? Right. There were six years difference between each of the children. I see. She was 12 years younger than my son, Henry Jr. I think your son went in partnership with your husband, isn't that right? He went into the real estate business. Why did he go into the real estate business? He had been in insurance. Well, he intended to remain in the insurance business. He thought that my youngest son would go into the real estate business. But when he didn come back he decided he would like the real estate business I imagine you were pleased?
Yes, we were very pleased. I always ask this, did you experience any anti-Semitism here in Dallas? Well, I never experienced any myself. My husband was very active during the Ku Klux Klan. He was very active with the Masonic Lodge and with the Temple also in trying to do away with the plan. My husband was very active in the Masonic lodge. He was, what he called it? Potentator. Potentator, the shrine here. Uh-huh. And he was a 33rd degree nation. Oh, uh-huh. Do you remember anything specific that was done to try to stop the Klan? No, I don't remember anything specific. Uh-huh. You always told me that Rabbi Lefkowitz was active in talking against the Klan.
No? Oh, I know what you used to, that was true, but I know what you used to tell me about the Dallas Morning News taking a stand against the Klan. Anyway. Yeah, but they did. Nothing anti-Semitic ever happened to you personally? Nothing. Can't ever remember any personal. That South Dallas for you Well you lived quite a bit with Jewish people And, well, I always had Gentile neighbors before I moved on South Boulevard. Because on Wendellkin Street, I think there were more Gentiles than there were Jews. But I never thought anything personal. I guess they were just too smart to let me know. And I never tried to go with them to force myself into their company.
I had my own friends. Right. And perhaps they might have thought that I was anti-Christian because I associated only with Jews. When you came to Dallas, what was the transportation? The transportation was the streetcar. Streetcars. I used the streetcar quite a bit. I never took drive. Did you ever learn to drive? Never learned to drive. When my husband first bought a car, he needed to end the business. Yeah. So we couldn't afford two cars at that time. Uh-huh. And then when we could, I didn't care about driving. Uh-huh. And my sister lived very close to me, and we nearly always went to the same places, and she drove.
But I used the streetcar quite a bit. Is that what most people used? Most people did. Did you ever go to, did the young people in your day go to Lake Cliff or Kid Springs or White Rock in the summertime? No. How did you keep cool in the summer? Did you think it was extra hot here, hotter than Kentucky? Well, I had an electric fan and did the best I could. We had a screen porch and we had a seating fan, and we kept pretty cool out there. Was the screen porch used for sleeping or for sitting? No, just for sitting around. Uh-huh. Is that where people would sit and visit?
Yes. On the screen porch? Leslie Jacobs Senior was very active in getting the old folks home started. In fact, I think she deserved a lot of credit. I think she was really the investigator of it. But that's much later. That's all right. But what do you remember about Mrs. Jacobs? What did she do that was extra? Well, she really started the old folks home. I'm sure that she gave financially and she gave a lot of her time. She was really truly interested. Do you remember women earlier, you mentioned Mrs. Cann and your mother-in-law, was her name Sophie? Yes. Sophie Miller, that were very charitable about visiting the poor.
Yes. Do you remember any other women who did that? No, I really don't know. Okay. Did the men do anything in a similar way? What would poor I going to just ask about Jewish people but what would poor people do if there was no Where would they go Would they go to a synagogue to ask for help what would they do before there was the Federation you recall I imagine they would there really was no place special to go unless they would call on some of these women they were acted in visiting them they probably they needed a doctor or something they probably would call Did you have your children at home?
Were they born at home? They were all born at home except Carmen Did you have a doctor? I had a doctor, yes You remember his name? I had Dr. Friedman delivered my first he was when my brother came here he went into Dr. Friedman's office but he didn't stay in there very long they were not I don't think they got along too well together and Dr. Friedman was not a charitable man And my brother was. So they didn't stay together very long. But Dr. Friedman delivered Henry Jr.? Henry Jr. And then Dr. Borland, who was a specialist here, delivered my younger boy. and Carmen. And after he delivered, Jack, my younger boy, he said he'd never deliver another child at home.
That was the last one he ever delivered at home. I had a very hard time. They brought him the kitchen table into my bedroom and my brother assisted him. But so when Carmen came I went to the hospital twice before she came home The third time was She came What hospital did you go to At that time it was Holy Catholic Hospital. St. Paul. St. Paul. It was where my brother did his work. Oh, uh-huh. Perhaps it was where Dr. Borland did his work. How long did your brother practice in Dallas? Well, do you remember when he passed away? I don't remember, but he did all of his practice here.
56, 1956 Doc died. Can you remember the names of any other doctors who practiced in Dallas? Well, there was Dr. Aronson. Aronson? There were two Dr. Aronson, Dr. Aronson and his son also. Oh, and I really can't remember. Okay. I didn't have this. Okay. You remember Dr. Levy? You remember Harry Levy? Yes, I remember Harry Levy. Now, you had a neighbor on South Boulevard, Dr. Wurtzman. Well, he was not a medical doctor. What was he? He was an optometrist. An optometrist. Oh, okay. At Niver, Metis. Oh, okay. Okay. He was the father of... Abby Eldridge. Yes. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. They were neighbors of ours on South Boulevard.
Right. And I believe, didn't Herbert Marcus live on your block? Yes. They lived next door to each other on South Boulevard. It been said that Carrie Herbert wife sister I getting mixed up that she had the real fashion sense in the family Well I sure that was true because she had worked for a Harrison company in the Early days. Early days, and she used to go to New York to buy for them. Oh, really? Did she have any training before that? No. Okay. I'm sure she didn't. Uh-huh. Where did she grow up? Well, she must have grown up in, uh, was it Marshall? Where he lived her?
Aunt Carrie? Where did Herbert grow up? Was it Marshall? I guess so. I don't know. I can't remember. I don't know where they are. Sure, it's in Stanley's book, but I can't remember. Where Herbert and Minnie. No, not Minnie, but Herbert. No, his sister Minnie. Oh, okay. Yeah, grew up. Okay. Theo and Herbert and Minnie and Carrie. Where did your aunt live? Their mother. Oh, and then there was Celia. And Celia, I forgot about her. So they lived in Louisville for quite a long time after the Barker's family moved to Texas. So they grew up in Kentucky. They grew up. Celia's family grew up in Kentucky.
Well, then Carrie grew up in Kentucky, too. Probably. And Carrie's sister was Celia, right? Yes. But there was quite a difference between their ages. Ages? There must have been. Okay. Cedar was... Older? Cedar or Gil was the oldest, and Carrie was the youngest. Carrie was born while my mother was living with them. But that was Kentucky? Yep. Mm-hmm. So Carrie was born in Kentucky? Yes. I guess the children went to school in Louisville. I want to thank you very much. For having this conversation with me. Well, I've been talking to you, and I'm sorry I couldn't give you more information.