Ivan Sacks
Ivan Sacks came from a family with deep South African roots. His parents were born in South Africa, and his father's father emigrated from Russia. His mother died of tuberculosis at age 35 when Ivan was young, so he knew little about her, while his mother's parents were both born in South Africa, including a grandmother from Malmesbury. Ivan grew up in the southern suburbs of Johannesburg in what he recalls, looking back, as a privileged and happy existence. His Jewish upbringing included Sunday school and Hebrew school and attending shul with his father on Shabbat, though he describes his family's practice as culturally rather than strictly religious. From age 12 he attended Christian Brothers College boarding school in Kimberley, where he was the only Jewish boarder.
After boarding school Ivan served his required time in the South African army, which he found easy given his boarding-school discipline, and later traveled to Israel. He earned a Bachelor of Commerce degree with a focus on accounting and worked briefly with a small firm and with Price Waterhouse. In 1980, as a restless young man of 24 seeking a future more aligned to his thinking, he immigrated to the United States as a single man and chose Dallas. His sister and her husband, who had considered Los Angeles, later moved to Dallas as well. After early jobs, including work with a long distance telephone company, he pursued his goal of stockbroking and, after many interviews, was hired by Don Hodges. Sponsored by the family of the woman he would marry, he gained citizenship, completed his broker training, and became a top-producing broker.
Ivan married Melanie in 1982, in ceremonies held both in South Africa and in Dallas. He found the transition into Jewish life in America challenging, having come from a South Africa where Jews of all practices belonged to one community without denominational labels, unlike the more divided Orthodox, Conservative, and Reform communities he encountered in Dallas. A strong cultural Zionist from a young age, he had collected for Israeli causes as a boy. In Dallas he became deeply involved in Jewish life and helped found a synagogue in the early 1980s. He also served as founding president of a prison Torah institute, an achievement of which he is especially proud. Ivan speaks warmly of the freedom and opportunity America has given him and his children, while cherishing the sincerity and simplicity of life he misses about South Africa.
He has retained his accent and returns to South Africa when he can.
Full Transcript
okay this is an interview with Ivan sacks that today is Monday September 16 hello Ivan hola hey awesome 13 2000s sir when and why if you can tell us did your family immigrated first immigrated to South Africa my parents were born in South Africa okay and before that what dad's father okay from Russia what they were cool a restaurant at the inner court in town for pompeian and if you through this I haven't what is it near the progression I could be near zoo anything I don't know where where's near but I supposedly look the Enya Russia but amalgamating some part of it okay so
what can you share that I'm sorry yes mother passed away when he was five so I didn't know anything about her she died at the age of 35 tuberculosis of me and then from my mother's side I believe both of them were born in south africa by grandmother was born in malmesbury oh no i haven't heard of it okay yes and i'm not sure we my grandfather was born so they won't know son but that would both born in South Africa ok so it's the generation mm-hmm what can you share about your early years in South Africa what stands out in your mind of your
life they're growing up there happy and outdoors didn't require a privileged life as just a happy person but Reggie looking back there was definitely a privileged existence that we had in terms of the setting that we landed up it was absolutely beautiful magnificent well why were you in Johannesburg okay in johannesburg in the southern suburbs of Johannesburg place fulfill extension look at 67 pluton on the road deception southern songs and yours they're not being northern suburbs right exclusive Richard are you married well that's right to it so tell me a couple of memories that you have of your early life Jewish Lee you're Jewish involvement
your family my family I went to a regular Hebrew recorded like a sweet sunday sunday school and then I went to Hebrew school preschool Hebrew school and then I had no added up for primary school under what you'd call Rob you have a primary school up until the nitrous that 12 I was a regular government school change the battery ah do you have another one that one sec I have ok watch me okay okay now we will continue I guess I was a primary school that a government school then I went to I just had Kayla lessons which would be with a rabbi a local
rabbi that lived in the area I remember Reverend Suzman what's its name and I learnt a little bit with it but nothing that was I could have been no rabbi nothing at all and so there was no Zhu Zhu Li other than the fact that I used to go to show my dad is the second one on Shabbat so the winter you ever used to work to show I still remember one leads to quad mm-hmm whatever reason you always remember your keeper of a person can was white and we're gonna meet and all the kids who stood out to me after that I desire to
see if it was painted yeah and to pass a few always remember because yet the mud send all the family used to get together professor and other than that it was nothing Chanukah was Han occur but nothing it was nothing memorable about anything other than others may Allah desperate okay how and why how old were you when you made the decision to leave South Africa and did you come alone anybody motmot when he just got back because altima primary school hmm i'd like to discard that I went to high school okay and I went to a fantastic year Jewish high school or christian brothers college
in kimberley so I went to boarding school from the age of 12 until the age of 7 p-2 christian brothers and that was school in which I was only Jewish student as far as boarding girls and their leftover probably about full file folders future okay so from the Golden City of Janice we're going to committee the diamond city ah very nice so when I know you travel to Israel at some point soon as right off to the army away to the army South Africa you know went to Israel and then I make a beautiful woman may wait I want to ask you because I I
haven't met anyone who maybe I have I didn't know who was in the South African army what was that like for you very easy because I've been at boarding school so I have really been I been disciplined already I'd been part of organization quotes felton flavor after bound so for me it was very very easy with the other Jewish guys it wasn't necessary babies any rain for how long as I need for you it was the final year in which you could only be in for your funny which have had to be for two years ok all right ok so continue then i win tonight
that a Bachelor of Commerce degree another live years of accounting with a small firm called JBN name with Price Waterhouse and then I decided America I'm coming my son came in nineteen eighty nope it was so political unrest and everything going on really didn't have much of a play in your decision it may have it may have and I felt it probably there if you future outside of South Africa that would be more an alignment to my way of thinking so I decided to come to America but when I came I came as a free agent 24 I didn't have I wasn't a political activist
for that way at all so it wasn't a wince I came here because I ran away from the South African situation this is the Restless young man looking did anybody else in your family come our soon after come my sister had made decision every through her husband at the time to live in Los Angeles but when I came like a stop live in Dallas I like Dallas and I told you I was going to be coming if I could come and they moved mm-hmm and then when I moved that it really moves yet oh here yeah that's it oh so that was a good impetus
to get you here all right wasn't it you manage to get me if it was nice to have family mm-hmm and your parents she's everything they chose to stay my mom I think would have left but my dad was adamant not you so the Union VA were there any other friends or any other influence people that you know that we're coming here that you actually talked you to come here okay what can meet more South Africans here than I make in South Africa because you forced him to a pool of meeting people right right now where did you live when you were you were you
already married no no no single okay because my wife and I had broken up marriage because on the night of whom you had to miss Muffy invitations would be to be mailed out I pulled the cord by a cold feet so that was a pretty hot moment and what I'll tell you today is because I thought that didn't deserve her she was a too much of a high level I just stopped trying to become able to later on get married about two years later so I did come over to the United States single mm-hmm okay now what you said you're who what job did you
have when you came here or did you first go looking for work well when I came in I came as a rule immigrant with no I was traveling and so what happened then is of my first job was a very exciting job I went in my catalog I think was any person and Erica Parsons lon that they'd left to be at least like four feet I was really rough and tough guy at that time a little low and low and I remember doing that that is my first job and then I worked for long distance telephone company which is called here Estella the time which
was downtown Dallas Brody and all I wanted to do was use my accounting and my people skills of enjoy being with people to get into stockbroking numbers and that I interviewed was 17 different companies another lie still got the notes everyone told me what a nice person I was but no one gave me the job because it was complicated with immigration and then one person did give me the job Jesus I am indebted to him really grateful Don hodges who is from a company called Roush appears breakfast you hired me how did you proceed on your path to getting citizenship elected meet a girl that
liked me at the time and her family agreed to sponsor ships family oh sure under ships of course good family canal room yesterday very possibly okay so what I'm write it into it okay very good did you have to take any classes or anything any-any accreditation to become a spell right yeah yeah yeah we kind of stopped broker you had to do cr7 763 form of training so the beautiful we can work become a broken 1981 and I became the number one producing brokenness in a fog your history fabulous I didn't know any better yeah and you were still single no Melanie had agreed to
marry me but nabe we were still like dialoguing and I'm backwards for what's in nutrients but you know and when did you get married but married in 1982 okay in twice just to make sure once ensuring South Africa and and then once in downtown samples judgment no judge lecture feelin like people did that United States so what was life if you can think back what was it like to really really get settled into the Dallas community in specific in general and also the Jewish community here well thinkety that lucky I came a single and then in selling million are we married we do it really
had much responsibility she didn't really have to worry about children or anything else like that at that time so for me it was I love doing what I love my work and it was just like an easy read not a problem at all enjoyed it very much in terms of Judaism I didn't know anything from South Africa when you come from South Africa you are conservatives so as conservative people live in America that's how we work we all were members of an orthodox shul in South Africa lived a conservative life so the rabbi was Orthodox and the people of the combatants were mostly conservative and
so we came available as it was a conflict because there was no conservatives it was much more defined when you came to America you are either Orthodox or you were conservative and you were a form or you or whatever and it was much more conflicting it wasn't a harmonized Jewish community in America it was a much more conflicted community because in South Africa everyone was respected whoever you were that person was author dr. case what about the person was conservative you didn't even know you were conservative you didn't have labels attached to you you were Jewish so from a living in South Africa was much more harmonious being Jewish and you weren't identifiable by how you practice your desertion much much easier transition yeah you forced not by decree or anything like it but you're forced to choose a channel by which you gotta practice and he felt it that way even back in the 1980s here in Dallas I most definitely because it was like let's say you went into a temple you were shocked because if you walk into a
temple and you don't have a yarmulke and that's what we were used to put it this way we were you you all you did was you would go into the future with your rear-view Murray so you gonna shower when I went to shoot in South Africa that young who woulda done every other cuz that was like shocking to the soul because all you're doing is driving into the future so initially that was I think the shock so what you do is I think I remember landing up at initially I never had any context of what the doxy was not strong in dallas at all at
the top and so I'll ended up I think interfered that's right it was no worth of us yeah children that is the closest we have in 1980 this is the closest unleaded up there with our member gain us to rev up questions which I really did enjoy her but a cigar think at the time in that only time but so at that that's hospital there was no in South Africa a maximum amount of involvement with Judaism but when I was young I was sent to sure but as an older person you just generally celebrated lesser energy per person who got her family and that would
be that would be the extent of it in the Shabbat with light candles and your help color which wasn't kosher so you'd say bracha a non-kosher fella there was no like you didn't think further than that that was the extent of being Jewish and then again you were just curious because we were proud of being Jewish and so that was much more Sun mystically inclined than it was religiously I was just gonna ask you that how did you fit into the Zionist there's necklace I was very strong as I mystically a Zionist to the point that like I went knocking on doors from the age
of 12 different apartments go to resume to freeze ray I didn't know what I was collected for then I'm knocked in one door which was a lady called not only soup and she was in charge with all that better love him for the Israeli wounded soldiers inside became very involved with that for a long period of time what South African if you can think about it South African cultural traditions have you brought here can you think of any that you don't want to lose even though you're living here you know for so long I haven't lost my accent me that's one thing I think lab
that weight with it I think you change your informations you notice that people listen to you in inverted commas they're more listening to the accent and our orders them to the words so you know that you're not being listened to but you've been you lulling them I don't know that I that I'm holding on to anything with any definite purpose I live just for the moment I don't have any proud of my background I only say that I'm proud of my background I'm happy with my life setting that I was that I fell into to sound proud not that I'm I'm proud I'm to say
I'm happy with the last City I landed up it what about your children do you think they consider themselves Oh Tilly a very kinky bet married too far ma appearance of poems I said it I sought to this day and never watched a football match I've never known a man that's unusual I mean most of that with every sporting orientated so I've never you know I know I constant you're living in dallas and i'll get all this for everyone talks about an obvious lack on the sidelines okay since you've been here have you known other friends or family members that have come here and emigrated
to the united states oh yeah i love it as I said I've bit more so everything together not together but did you didn't know them did you pretty sir there was one individual that on the other way other than that not and nobody in the near future coming here that you know of anybody still living still there come on come on by then living they still and I've got much sister that we made my sister that lived here in Dallas move to and made a dr to you bro oh how often do you go back whenever I can I like maybe once you still yes
Nick Melanie said she hasn't gone back she hasn't gone back since of carrots passed away I think her going back is with heavy heart yeah that's understandable so in a nutshell what if anything do you really miss about South Africa I love the sincerity which you don't find their of length unless the smiles of the blacks the picture behind me it's probably reflective of that simplicity of life I love just walk in the street and a white will not say hello with a smile black the sails with full team yes PU that's what i would say i miss ya interesting so do you now consider
yourself an American now that you have your citizenship or do you hesitate to what label would you give yourself yeah I'm proud to live in America I love the freedom and opportunities that it provides for me I'm not hesitant in terms of saying because put this way if you become a citizen of a country you are an American Siam American are loyal to the country and I'm a prestressed set of opportunity for the opportunity that's given me and for my kids and particularly for the fact that as the trigger which are extremely proud of being Jewish that it gives us a force asset that freedom
which I don't think any other country in the world has provided for Jewish people if you had to do some things over again is there anything you would have done differently of your personal immigration from there to here look of your journey from place to place now we've been the same we're exactly what of them of course whatever has happened we find tended to be in the other way it landed up executive worth me to be as far as a lasagna but I've been very involved in Judaism identical in Dallas because when I can go out and have that identity in terms of three I
want to go and then I found the place at our own nineteen eighty-three years something like that and I've been affiliated with innocence in the prison of a synagogue fool I don't know how many years like 10 years whatever and then now is responsible for the founding with reveron of the Texas story Institute which was the prison founding president of it and really proud of it anything you'd like to add before we end before we end nah just out of there laughs I'm and you we should all very the Catalan you