Full Transcript
17th, 1971. And, Mr. Ekstra, can you tell us how long you've been in Dallas? How long has your family been in Dallas? My family came here, as best I know, about 1980. I mean 1890. I was born here on South Eckerd Street at Hughes Circle. on June 30, 1899. So I've been here 73 years, 72 years. Where did your forefathers come from? My father came from Baltimore, Maryland. My mother came from Cincinnati. Do you know where their forefathers came from and when? Not too much. My paternal grandmother was born in America. She was a cod, K-A-H-N. And that must have been around, she must have been born about 1840.
My grandfather, my paternal grandfather, came from Eastern Germany, I think. My maternal grandfather, nobody knows that much about him. He died at a very early age. My grandmother came from Germany. You said you were born on South Africa, though your parents lived there. What were some of the moves that you made in the city as you grew? Well, we lived at the original location until I probably was 17 years of age. Then we moved further up on Agnes Street for two or three years. And then my family built a house on South Boulevard at Atlanta Street. So those were the three locations. I lived, of course, after I got married.
I didn't live in that ghetto. It was a very plush ghetto, but still a ghetto. So that I moved around a good deal About up until when what year would you say about what year did you live in South Dallas I lived in South Dallas probably until 23 or 24 1923 or 24 I had married and we moved out. And I rented a house on, I don't remember the street, it's one of the short streets between Gaston and Genius out by Liquid Country Club. And from there? Then we moved into another house on Swift Avenue. Then the marriage broke up. And I went back to live with my parents for three or four years.
And I remarried. I moved out of Park West. And from there I moved out on a farm. It was a farm then, now. It's on Greenville Avenue, south of Forest Lane. So I lived there. That marriage went to pieces. I bought a lot and I built a house on Euclid in Highland Park, where I expected to die. Did you have a, did you go to Sunday school? Oh, yes. I went, I was very religious, taught Sunday school. I put it all, they kicked me out, which was after I had graduated from college, as I remember it. But I was very felt. I never missed a Saturday morning.
I came from a very... My father was deeply religious. My mother was an observant person, but she had the depth of his feeling for religion. He really was a very deeply religious man. You remember, it was at Temple Emanuel, wasn't you? Yes. When it was on South Hervey Street, and then when it was on South Bullhorns. We always observed the regular holidays I fasted on Yonge a long time The day of New Year Yom Kippur Purim Hanukkah service too. As a Passover, those were the main problems. But ours was not kind of a family that believed in just observing. You had to be part of it.
Did you have a Seder at home? Oh, yes. Do you continue in your observance, or how has it changed over the years? I have completely, I haven't been a member of Temple Emanuel in many years. And the last three or four years I have not given to the Jewish welfare, because I had to find out who I was. I went to Israel, and I could not identify with those people. I had great admiration for them. But as a race or a nation, they were, I could not. So therefore it seems to me that I was being hypocritical, and that I had paid my observance to my memory of my mother and father, and I just quit.
did you have any feelings or had you seen or felt any changes up until the point that you went to Israel when did you go oh I don't know the first change in my attitude to the religion was in the first world war I walked many a night trying to understand how an omnipotent God could let this happen to me and I guess beneath that I was not unlike your Vietnam hippies I didn't want to go get shot and I didn't believe for a minute we were making the world think for a democracy so that really terminated my religious experience What were your feelings when the Second World War came By that time, I guess I had gotten more realistic.
See, the odd thing about the American people is that while they have this tremendous industrial know-how, they're as naive as children. And I knew that we had to fight Hitler and in Europe. But by that time I was too old to be a party to it, so it didn't bother me as much. Did you have any feelings about the destruction of Jews in Europe? okay I think as anybody else might have but not the typical Jewish reaction I mean if I were and I do remember the Jews here in this town were just couldn't keep their knees from hitting one another in fear and it was a very cowardly reactions so that I did feel it was horrendous thing but not as a Jew as human being they were so so much of their thinking and feeling based surely on fear if they didn't do something to stop it there in Germany if the same thing would happen to all the American Jews which wasn't likely to happen but they were just scared within an inch of their lives and this dominated their their whole attitude do you feel they didn't have faith in the I don't know.
All I think is that they felt that if they didn't do something about it, the things would happen in this country. I told you it was lack of faith that democracy was just sheer fear. Well now, did you completely drop Jewish observes? Yes. Was it gradual? Well, it's been gradual, except, well, gradual in the sense that it probably happened over a 20-year period. But there was no other than the fact that I could not believe in The God figure after World War one and I knew I was through with religion as such Now I took me a longer time to dissociate myself from the Jewish community And I had help because it was very made clear to me by my Jewish friends that I could either go with them exclusively or not go with them at all and of course being an arbitrary contrary beast they they supplied my answer for that way your Jewish friends all of temple or were they some more traditional or no they were all the
temple were there any of the temple group at that time that had affiliations within our close friends of Jewish friends as well as non-jewish not many had any non-jewish friend I had some I had felt some through college I went I went to University of Texas and that was the first time that I ever had consciousness of being Jewish and that I was discriminated about bound to the fraternity system very badly and it hurt me very deeply so that I concluded at that time to make some associations that were not Jewish just to heal my wounds more than anything else but they developed it some
very deep good relationships so that when I graduated and came back by that time I did have some non friends but most of my people in the group that I had gone with did not have time Did they frown upon the friendships? Oh yes. Did they not accept, actually frown upon them? Well actively, because as I say, I never shall forget that one of the more intelligent, sensitive ones, my friends, just said to me frankly, look you can't have friends in both groups you either go with us or you're deaf and that's really the way they felt well that was 30 or 40 years ago and it's a brand new ballgame but I found them as I say I've always found them to be basically with their economic prosperity a pretty smug in the new Well, did you have any conflict of feeling as far as your identification with your fellow Jews as opposed to the kind of Jews?
Only that I didn't appreciate their attitude towards restricting my way of living. And I married the first time with a Jewish girl, and the second time I married, I swore I never would marry one again, and didn't. Because it's a matriarchal society, as you know, and I couldn't stand it. Do you feel there's been any change in that type of society over the years? Yes, a great change. great I have a son who's 45 years old and he lives here and I don't know too much about it but they have a good number of Gentile friends now basically I think they till they awfully smug But they closest friends and one of the people they see mostly are Jewish couples For no good reason other than that they're Jewish couples, from my point of view.
Do you think they feel perhaps more comfortable with them? They must. I don't know. Did you feel any difference as far as comfort was concerned with your Jewish friends as opposed to your non-Jewish friends? I was much more relaxed with my non-Jewish friends. Did you feel there were any, was there any particular reason? Except that I think their culture pattern did not require faithfulness. or singular life you were a human being just happened to be a Jew well now previously you said you had a discriminant you had experiences where you've been discriminated against as a Jew that's right but I overcame those the taxes for as well as you could be expected to well now have your children married Jewish yes was the Sunday school the extended your religious education did you have any Hebrew training no was the Hebrew training in temple at that time no not now your children married Jewish yes with the Sunday school you extended your religious education did you have any Hebrew training no was there Hebrew training in temple at that time there There was a sort of gesture of it, but not in today's sense at all.
When did you change or was it again over a period of time your Jewish observances I can tell you that it must have been over a period of time But once I decided that I could not conscientiously go along with the practice of Judaism Then I had to exclude certain other things or I'd have been hypocritical. Do you feel then it was solely a religious experience or was it also a culture? was both because I don't know how to relate culture and religion except among the Jews I do think there is a separate cultural pattern there used to be I don't know that there is anymore for instance when I was growing up I was sent to the theater because this was a good way to live.
Now whether in this day and age anybody has any culture, I begin to wonder whether there's a need for culture. Now what sense are you speaking in culture? yes all of the arts theater music painting writing now what about the ways things are done culture and this what do you mean attitudes towards charity attitudes towards humanity I don't know that I can speak for anybody except myself because you've got to you can't deny that there are certain Jews who have been always ridiculously generous in their support of Israel the generosity there has been such amazing to me but But it's there. all of Jews if you were to say this is a Jewish trait
