Yehudit Wider
Yehudit Wider's family roots trace to Lithuania and White Russia (Belarus) before her grandparents came to South Africa. Her maternal grandfather Benny, from Lechovich, worked in the coal business and later as an estate agent, while her maternal grandmother Nina, from near Ponevezh in Lithuania, worked as a bookkeeper. Her paternal grandfather Morris was a South African-born accountant, and her paternal grandmother Sonia, from Lithuania, also worked as a bookkeeper and raised her two sons alone after divorcing. Her parents, Gerald and her mother, met on the steps of the Oxford Synagogue in Johannesburg. Her father became a prosthodontist, training in Boston, while her mother was known for her spirituality and love of religion.
Yehudit was the third of four girls, raised in the Riviera suburb of Johannesburg near her mother's family. She describes a wholesome, deeply religious childhood in a home she compares to Abraham's tent, always open to guests, including scholars from Israel who stayed in the children's rooms. Shabbat tables lasted for hours with lively conversation among guests of all ages. She attended a religious school, was active in the Oxford Synagogue youth group led by a Chabad rabbi, and later became a youth leader. At age 12 she traveled to Israel with her family for Sukkot, visiting prominent rabbis, an experience that made a lasting impression on her.
After high school Yehudit studied reflexology, physiology, anatomy, and Chinese medicine, then spent a year at the Benot Yaakov seminary in Jerusalem. Determined to marry and live in Israel, she was matched with her husband through a shidduch and they married in April 2011, settling in Jerusalem. Visa complications with her green card led them to South Africa for five years, where her husband taught and worked in trade and she worked as a reflexologist and teacher. Because her husband's family, including grandparents Max and Lily Wider, was from Texas, the family eventually moved to Dallas. Now raising three daughters, she has grown to love Texans and hopes to pass on the living Torah example she learned from her parents.
Full Transcript
. Good morning. We're here today on March the 3rd, 2016. This is an interview for Roots to Boots project, and I'm interviewing Yehuda Weider. Yehuda, I'd like to start by asking you what you can tell me about the history of your grandparents from Europe, where the family started prior prior to South Africa? What can you tell me about that history? Okay, so my first set of grandparents, my parents, my father, sorry, my mother's parents, namely Benny and Nina. Benny, my maternal grandfather, was from Lechovich in White, Russia. And his grandparents were Issa and Yigodet Kaplan. And he was born in 1918. My grandmother Nina, his wife, was born in Krakanova, which is 30 kilometers south of Ponevish in Lithuania.
And she actually lived under the Ponevish Arab, which was with Yosef Kahideman. And her parents were Shalom Zev and Khanasorasi. And she was born around 1916 and lived about 78 years. Also her trade over there was bookkeeping and she worked for her brothers in an engineering company. My father's parents were Morris and Sonia. And Morris was born in South Africa and in Pretoria. And he was born in 1918. And his parents were Ada and Getzel. and they came from White Russia, known also as Belarus. Then my grandmother, Sonia, was born in Jalulok, which was 100 kilometers southwest of Vilna in Lithuania. Her parents were Maya Arya and Lea Korin.
And she just recently passed away last Monday at the age of 92. She worked in an office also as a bookkeeper for an estate agency Back to my grandfather Benny he came to South Africa to work in the coal business and later became an estate agent. My grandfather, Morris, was an accountant. He finished school at the age of 15 and he finished his degree at the young age of around 22. And how did your grandparents meet to form a family? I think they did meet in Europe. And they met in South Africa. They met in South Africa. And on your father's side, what do you know about the living situation of the grandparents in South Africa?
Where did they live? And what city did they live in? So they lived in Pretoria, in a city called Coppice. And the situation there was very, very racist. My grandmother had a very hard time going from school to home, along with her brother Oscar. And they were oftentimes attacked by black people. And they would throw locks. There was a lot of racism going on there, also between the Afrikaners. a little bit of anti-Semitism. And my uncle, my great-uncle, my grandmother's brother Oscar, a story is told that he was tied up to a tree and he was left there. He was left there just to be pitied, and that was very shameful for him.
What year would that have been? About what time did you think? He must have been in his teens, And my grandmother was born in the early 1900s, around 1960. So he must have been in his teens. And then on your grandmother side where were they living So they lived in Johannesburg in a place called Houghton There were two parts of Houghton beautiful area One was Upper Houghton and one Lower Houghton. They lived in Lower Houghton. And was there a large Jewish community there at the time, or was it small? It was small, relatively small, but definitely growing. And then how did your, on your mother's side, how many children were there in the family?
There were four. So she was the second, and above her was a brother, and below her were two brothers. What do you know about your mother's childhood? She had a great childhood. She had cousins who were girls who she mainly stuck around and hung with because her brothers were very wild. She was a tomboy. Her brothers would chase her through the house, and she would, one time they chased her through a glass door, they climbed up trees, they were very, very wild. My grandfather was well off, she had a nice home, she was pampered, she was well looked after, and she had a massive interest in religion.
She's a very spiritual soul. And she went, unlike her brothers, who were a little bit more Zionistic and more traditional, she became more religious. When you say more religious, was she allowed to go to a religious school, or what type of education did she have? So she did not go to a religious school. She went to Bani Benata, and she was given a secular education, but she was taught on the side was, she was taught on the side of religious studies. And what about your father? What about his family? So his family were very religious. His grandfather, Maya, was, his grandfather, Maya, was a rabbi.
He did shritah. He was very well-versed in Torah learning. So my grandfather grew up, My father grew up in a very religious environment. And did he have siblings? Yes, he has one young brother. And my grandmother, the one who just passed away last Monday, Sonia, she had my father Gerald and the doctors warned her never to have more children because during his birth her hearing got affected and there was hearing loss and she was told never to have children again And despite what she was told, she did not heed the words of the doctors. She said, my son will never have, I will not allow my son to go as a single child.
He needs a sibling. She did fall pregnant again. She had a miscarriage, but then she tried again, and she had my uncle beyond. And what kind of education did your father have? Was he in a religious school? He went to King David, King David, Lings Hills, in Johannesburg. It was a balanced school, secular and religious, more secular. But he became a prosthodontist. He specialized in his dentistry and prosthodontics in Boston, where my mother and him lived together. My mother always says for 33 long months because she was far away from home. She didn't love it, but she was there to support him to get his degree.
How did your parents meet? There was a shill named Oxford Shill, Oxford Synagogue. It was huge, it seats about 1,500 people. And my mother's parents lived in Houghton near the synagogue. And my father and his mother, because my grandparents got divorced, so my grandmother Sonia brought her boys up alone, and they lived in an area called Melrose, which was also near to Oxford Shul. And it was a very social shul, very young, vibrant, lively, and they met on the steps of Oxford, synagogue. Was this while your father was in dental school? or prior to that? I'm not sure. So they met in the show and do you know anything about their courtship?
I do know that my mother, she was fancy by many boys and a cute story is that she actually went out with two at the same time and the one would hold his hand around her body and the other would hold and they realised that they were holding each other's hands which was quite Cute. My father came along the scene and the brothers, my mother's brothers, had to check out who would be the, you know, the suture for my mother. And the way they tested my father out was if he was able to reel the film. In those days they had to reel the film.
And my father was able to. He was very technical, very handy with his hands. He still is. and he could have been an engineer but he became a prosthodontist so there was a test that he passed my mother still had to choose so they married what year did they marry? my mother was born 1948 and she got married at the age of 24 and my father got married I was born in 1946 got married around just beginning his 27th birthday Okay And how many children are in your family? I'm one of four girls I'm a third Tell me about your childhood What city were you living in when you were a child?
I lived in Johannesburg in an area called Rivera beautiful suburb very near all my uncles on my mother's side. My father's brother lived in another area, Glen Hazel, which was not in a walking distance. I loved Judaism. Our parents had a ton of guests. Their home was always open, literally like Abraham's tent, open on all four sides. There was never a time, my mother said, to never close the doors to anybody. Her heart is full of welcoming guests, we had to give up our rooms for huge tamideh hachamim I think only now I realize the the beauty that we were able to give up of our beds, which then was hard as a young girl but now I appreciate and I realize how special and unique that was, because these are not just simple people they were people that came from Israel to collect money in South Africa And the reason that came to my parents was because they were the only religious ones in that area.
And they needed a place to stay And that area was quite well off So my upbringing was very wholesome I went to Basiakov School a religious school I was given a good secular education. And I had a lot of friends in the area. Shul was exciting. Synagogue was very exciting. There were always youth programs. When I got older, I became one of the youth leaders. so my youth experience was very positive and very full, very enriched our Shabbat tables were full of different conversations adults ranging from all ages from little to 92 years old, even older we had once a 101 year old person at our Shabbat table so the topics were very varied huge variety and my sister and I always used to have fun in the kitchen, decorating the food.
We had about four course meals because the meals went on for hours because the guests were so interesting. That's fabulous. Tell me about the youth group. What was the name of the youth group? It was an Oxford synagogue youth group. Was it Zionistic? Yes. And also it had a because it was run by Chabad. The Chabad rabbi was Rabbi Bernard. So yes, it did have Zionism because the shul was, even though it was run by a rabbi, there were Zionist members. Did you have an opportunity as a young person to go to Israel? I did. I went at the age of 12. I went with my parents and my siblings.
My father wanted to show us and give us an experience of Sukkot in Israel. And I will never forget that experience because we stayed in an apartment in Jerusalem, in Harnoff, on Rehov Katzenelonbogen. Very long name, Katzenelonbogen. And throughout the days of Sukkot, we would wake up to the Brikat Hakohanim. And it was just a buzz. And it was great. It was our alarm clock. You know, it was beautiful. And my parents made sure that we would have also an enriched educational trip. So we went to visit very important rabbinim like Rav Kahanaman or we went to Bnei Brak we went to see Rav Eliyashiv we went to see Rav Shach you know, quite important and significant rabbinim.
And I remember sitting with them in their sukkah and just looking at them, because all of these rabbis, their eyes were so piercing, they were so pure. And they would share with my parents, you know, to read Torah. And my father and my mother, like I told you, were completely soaked. They soaked up Torah. Wherever they went, they would just absorb anything they could hear. So after your high school experience in South Africa, Did you go on to further studies in South Africa? I did. I started studying reflexology and physiology, anatomy, and Chinese medicine. Then I went off to Israel for one year to seminary in Jerusalem, and the seminary was called Benot Yaakov, Yerushalayim, quite a small seminary.
At the time, my sister Daniela, my older sister, married and had three kids, was living in Israel, in Jerusalem, in Ramachdohol, which was very helpful. But I didn't feel too homesick. I could go to go in Ramachdohol. wanted and the year was full of learning and full of new friendships, full of new experiences, visiting new areas, whether it was Ashkelon, Ashdod, Tzvak, Tveria, Haifa, it was full. It gave us a huge scope of Israel. At what point did you meet your husband? So I returned to South Africa to finish my studies in reflexology. I also was a swimming coach. And in December, when I was going to turn 21, I really, really wanted to go back to Israel.
And I said to Hashem, please, I want to get married. I want to go back to live in Israel. and I will go to please help me find a shidduch find your Suta because I going to Israel now And whether I find a Suta or not after Pesach of the following year I going to live in Israel And my mind was set on getting married. I turned 21 in that December and 2003 I went to my sister I went to visit her I helped her with her children there was the South African summer versus the Israel winter so I gave up my summer but I had a great trip my sister was very friendly with a woman named Russ Applebaum, his husband was a Rosh Yeshiva in Torah Ork, where my husband was learning.
So my sister mentioned to Russ that, my sister is in town, do you have any guys? Yes, there were a few options available. We looked into three of them. One wasn't in town, and my husband was in Israel, in Jerusalem, and the way the Shidduch system is set up that you have a mediator and you have the Shadchan. So Rus was both the Shadchan, the matchmaker, and the mediator. And we met, we did not go out for long, and he fit all the criteria that I wanted. I wanted someone who was a bent Torah, who was immersed in Torah learning, whose focus was that, and along with other things that we discussed.
So we did meet, we met in Israel, we dated, and we got married in April of 2011. And did you continue to live in Israel? Yes. I made Aliyah in South Africa and got married in Israel. And we rented an apartment in Jerusalem in Ramat Eshgal on Rokhov Paran, which is now bustling and booming with youngsters. At the time, on this trip, there were not as many kosher restaurants or supermarkets. But then there was a significant amount and sufficient amount of young, learned couples that were living in the area. So we lived there for three years. And then did you go back to South Africa or did you come to the United States?
Very interesting story. I applied for a visa, a green card, in Israel. Oh, in Israel. This was of Pesach, Pesach time. So we got married Pesach time. We were there for three years. In that third year, at Pesach time, I applied for a green card. And it took time. We also had to wrap up our rent. So, and we needed to, we were planning to go to America. And on route to America, we were planning to go visit my sister. in London. However, because my green card was not fully complete, the law at the time did not allow me to enter America and finish off the green card process in America.
So we were stuck between no rental and all our belongings being shipped off to America. And we couldn't even enter America. So our only choice was to go back to South Africa. And that's what you did. And that's what we did. And how long were you there? For five years. And what did you do there? What did you and your husband do while you were there? So my husband was a Rebbe. He was in learning. He first was in learning full time in the Kodal. And then he started to slowly learn in the morning and then teach in the afternoon. And then later on he went into trade.
He went into selling Tupperwares, plastic wares, and then he went into Konica Minolta, which was printers into the printing field. And I was working as a reflexologist. I also used my teaching. I taught in a school called Maharsha and Torah Academy. So we were very busy. How did you eventually wind up here in Dallas? Well, my husband is from Texas. Oh, I didn't know that. Yes. So tell me about your husband's family and where in Texas they're from. So, my husband's grandfather, Max Wider. Oh, okay. I know Max and Lily. Yes. Now I know the connection. Yes. I did not realize that. So Max and Lily are my husband grandparents I see They live in St Annis As you know they came from Corpus Christi Yes they live a block away from here They live right down the street actually Yep, on the corner.
Yes. Okay. So, I married a Texan. I did not plan to live in Texas. I wasn't opposed to South Africa, but my dream was to live in Israel. But you know how it goes. man proposes and God disposes or man has plans and we just have to accept what the plan is and go with the flow. So is your husband working in the family business at this point? He was. And now he's not. So what is your husband doing at this point? So now he's in real estate. And is he also learning and teaching? he is not he is teaching his family he is teaching his kids he is very busy with his and he is learning he sticks to which is a fixed term for learning and you are teaching right?
yes and aside from obviously having family here from the standpoint of integrating into the Dallas community how did you find out from a personal standpoint? What was it like for you? I'm a very outgoing person. I make friends easily. The change did take me about two years to integrate because culturally South Africans are very different. I do love Texans. I've learned to love them. I've learned the culture. So, coming from South Africa, where everyone comes from Lithuania, and there's that same mindset. And we have a history. I had generations, my grandfather, my parents, my family, all my cousins, and my siblings, nieces and nephews. coming to America, I did feel lonely and I did feel left out on that side, on that point.
But I did know that I had to go with my husband, where his livelihood would be. And with that mindset I knew that I had five years which were a bonus Five years that my parents saw my kids my kids saw my parents and their cousins So I didn't feel like I lacked anything. I think had I gone from Israel to America, it would have been much harder. I thank Hashem that He gave me that transition. And coming to America, I found there's a huge, there's diverse people. I mean, they come from all over, all over the states. So having to learn where they come from and who their kids are and what school they go to and the schools and learning about them, I'd like to know who my friends are.
In South Africa, I knew who my friends are. I knew who their uncles were. I knew who their cousins were. Here, I didn't want to just look at the person as a person. I'd like to see the person as a whole. So that's taken me time. And now I feel comfortable. I feel comfortable with my friends. I feel comfortable with the Shulaguru. I feel comfortable with my home, my environment, and the culture. And I like Texans. They're very warm and welcoming. Great. Is there anything in particular that you miss about South Africa or the family? The food. The food. Any food in particular? Yeah. Bulls on, which you call beef jerky.
Yes. Puff, which is, it's a maze. It's just made by Africans. My housekeeper would make it for us. And I miss the dried fruit, which has no sugar added. In America, it's totally different. and the chocolates and the crisps, the junk food. Are crisps like potato chips or whatever? Yeah, chips, crisps. Chips. Yeah, although I did find a South African store here. The one up on Preston, is it? The one up on Coit. Coit and McCallum. Oh, okay. Yeah, so I treat my kids there once a month. When we're Jewish, when they import goods, so we just do a once a month treat. Oh, I see.
That's good. And they're just reddish in there. The appletazer, the flings, the Cadburys, the fizzes. Very good. How old are your children now? So my oldest I have three daughters My oldest is turning 10 Then I have an 8 and year old Excellent Is there anything that I left out that you like to add that would be important for your children to know as life goes forward and important for them to know about your life history? I just like them to know that I miss a maid. You miss a maid. I love my maid. She was like a second mother. That's not important for them, but for me it was just something to just to confide in as well, who saw me grow up.
The message that I'd like to give my kids, and hopefully I can continue to give them, is the home that I grew up in. That wasn't just talking about doing an action, about honoring guests and opening up your home. It wasn't just textbook. It was practical living. It was something I saw on a daily basis. I saw my father learning. He says, here's Gomorrah open. He had a partner in learning. And that's what I'd like to give to my children, to give them the example of living a rich Torah life, not just text Torah life, but real living life. Because Torah is compared to a tree.
It's living. So I thought I would like to continue to give them, and I feel that I have covered everything. I think you're setting a wonderful example, and certainly you've got that example from your parents. Oh, yeah. But I feel like I still don't know it all. I still call my mother and I say, Mommy, please explain this because she's a historian. Mommy, please explain that. And she just rattles away and I say, Hold on, slow down. I can't catch her quick enough because she's just been learning for years. And I admire her. I love her. I look up to her. She certainly set a wonderful example and you're blessed to still have her with you.
Oh, yeah. Thank you so much. It's been a pleasure interviewing. and I wish you and your husband and your children all the best. Thank you so much. It's been a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you.